Chemiclean

[Vance]

Anyone have experience with this stuff? No ill effects on corals/fish/inverts? Be upset if it killed my seahare but poor little guy cant keep up with the cyno that came with the new biopellet reactor. Always had a little cyno as i dose vodka but damn! Is an airpump/stone really necessary with the skimmer running? Lots of air sucked down the standpipe and a separate overflow for the fuge, tons of surface agitation never had O2 problems even when the tank crashed by reaching 96degrees. Should i remove the biopellets for treatment or are they okay? Don't run carbon or any absorbing media like that.
Thanks everybody,
Vance

 

[ReeferMatt]

I have used this product with great success. You CAN NOT run your skimmer with this product, it will overflow in seconds (think mentos in a 2 liter of cola)!!!! So yes, an airstone is absolutely necessary. Secondly, you should remember to take your rockwork into account when calculating your total water volume, if in doubt under-dose! Third thing to remember is to do a LARGE water change 48 hours after dosing, this is a must and has to be done before bringing your skimmer back online. The last thing to remember is that this is not a fix all, it will get rid of the cyano but will not fix the underlying problem. It will however start you over at a place where your tank will be more manageable. I would take any reactors and carbon offline for the 48 hours of dosing to ensure you do not filter the chemiclean or contaminate any medium, you never know how things are going to react to this stuff. This can be a good product, but be smart about how you use it and good luck!

 

[Vance]

Instructions say keep the skimmer running just dial it back. Dont run anything other than the biopellets, and quick fix is all im looking for, not a nutrient problem just increased bacteria from biopellets. Trying to be smart , that's why im asking.

Whats the risk of overdosing? What exactly is it?

 

[ReeferMatt]

Crazy, the instructions on my box say to "turn off protein skimmer, UV steralizer and or ozonizer, remove carbon for 24 hours after dosing". You might be ok with it dialed down, but it REALLY foams up! I forgot to turn it off last time I dosed and it made a huge mess! Here is a good forum on overdose: http://www.dfwmas.org/Forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=45957&start=0

 

[Catfish Charlie]

This product came highly recommended from our customers that maintain aquariums for a living. Our customers that use this product has had great success with it!

 

[reef dummy]

I haven't been able to turn my skimmer on for a week now, lol.

 

[Vance]

Are there different product lines by chemiclean? This really does say leave skimmer on right on the box.

 

[Vance]

So any thoughts on leaving the biopellets in during treatment? Its not an absorbing media, quite the opposite actually, as a carbon source for bacteria. Is chemiclean an anti-bacterial? Will it just kill of the culture on the pellets? I dose vodka as well to boost the bacteria. Anyone have any experience with this stuff in an ultra low nutrient system? If it's anti-bacterial won't it just cause a worse problem in this type of system? Other than freeing up trapped nutrients for removal?

 

[Denver aquarist]

I have used it a bunch on my 75 gallon works great just do water changes after follow the instructions and you cant go wrong

 

[daverf]

Crazy, the instructions on my box say to "turn off protein skimmer, UV steralizer and or ozonizer, remove carbon for 24 hours after dosing". You might be ok with it dialed down, but it REALLY foams up! I forgot to turn it off last time I dosed and it made a huge mess! Here is a good forum on overdose: http://www.dfwmas.org/Forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=45957&start=0

My box says the same. www.chemipure.com. You'll read tons on skimmer issues in using Chemiclean. Even if you follow the directions on the "normal" box (what Matt describes), the skimmer will go nuts for awhile after it is turned back on.

Have you checked your phosphate lately? I've repeatedly used Chemi Clean, but have switched to more extreme phosphate reductions (Lanthanum) to limit the regrowth and need to reuse the product. I'm afraid to run chemiclean too often since it is an antibiotic (despite that Boyd is able to get around the need to label it as such) and has so much "controversy" in whether it is good or not.

Bio pellets shouldn't have any interaction, except that chemiclean may kill off some or all of the carbon consuming bacterial colony that biopellets support (?, possibility not certainty). Having the reactor on or off wouldn't make a difference (I don't think). If that die off would occur, then you're temporarily re-increasing the nitrate/phosphate nutrient source so you'd have to watch that after you run the treatment (ie you won't kill off every last cyano spore and there may be more nutrients available after the product is used).

Agreed on adding an airstone. Since the product will consume tank oxygen, I think the idea is that you supplement oxygen exchange when you use it...even if your tank has good oxygen exchange in place currently...so as to not shock your inhabitants. The double hit of skimmer off, product in will drop the oxygen. My fish would definitely hang out by the surface of the tank, even when I added an airstone and changed the overflows a bit to increase water agitation (ie opened my return ball valve to create more return waterfall etc).

 

[Vance]

Yeah phosphates are less than .1ppm, have had very good luck with vodka carbon dosing up to this point. Just added the biopellet reactor to get off the daily dosing regime, so i can go camping and on vacation without worrying. Just added 21 fish in a month so a bloom was expected with the addition of another carbon source.

So it is an anti-bacterial? Thanks man that was exactly the answer i was looking for. I've worked too hard to get the bacteria populations to where they are now, and it seems this might throw that stability out of wack. I'll just stick to the old fashioned way of manual removal to get the trapped nutrients out and my carbon dosing and water changes . May take a little more time but i feel a lot better about that than adding a chemical that will kill my precious bacteria. Quick fix does appeal to my lazy side though .

 

[Vance]

*and on a side note* Whoo! I'm a chromis now, no longer waste sludge!!

 

[Catfish Charlie]

The BIGGEST mistake I see when my customers use this produce is that they do not take into account water displacement of sand, rock, filter and etc. when dosing! This is a MUST when using this product and some of the problems mentioned may have been avoided. Although this product works well (if used as directed) it's a "band-aid" to the problem and not usually a fix. Also Banded Sleeper Gobies will usually eat cyanobacteria and reef safe. Again this is only a "fix" and not a cure.

 

[Vance]

The BIGGEST mistake I see when my customers use this produce is that they do not take into account water displacement of sand, rock, filter and etc. when dosing! This is a MUST when using this product and some of the problems mentioned may have been avoided. Although this product works well (if used as directed) it's a "band-aid" to the problem and not usually a fix. Also Banded Sleeper Gobies will usually eat cyanobacteria and reef safe. Again this is only a "fix" and not a cure.

Yeah but if it is going to decrease my buffered beneficial bacteria population I dont think it is a good fix for my system, like i said ive work too hard to get it up to those levels. And i don't have sand so no sleeper gobies... Thanks for the yesterday salt btw

 

[Vance]

stupid lack of editing... "salt yesterday btw"

 

[daverf]

Yeah phosphates are less than .1ppm, have had very good luck with vodka carbon dosing up to this point. Just added the biopellet reactor to get off the daily dosing regime, so i can go camping and on vacation without worrying. Just added 21 fish in a month so a bloom was expected with the addition of another carbon source.

So it is an anti-bacterial? Thanks man that was exactly the answer i was looking for. I've worked too hard to get the bacteria populations to where they are now, and it seems this might throw that stability out of wack. I'll just stick to the old fashioned way of manual removal to get the trapped nutrients out and my carbon dosing and water changes . May take a little more time but i feel a lot better about that than adding a chemical that will kill my precious bacteria. Quick fix does appeal to my lazy side though .

Your phosphates are actually very high, and could be partly to blame for the bloom. You want to get them down to .03-.05. There could be something going on with your changing the carbon source too (ie maybe a temporary issue that will pass). I added a biopellet reactor for the same reason as you.

I've done a lot of things to my display that have impacted the bacterial filter and/or caused a recycle, so I've been aggressive versus conservative. Fortunately thought, I haven't killed any life for awhile . I did take the risk/plunge with Chemiclean, I saw absolutely no impact to the nitrifying bacteria and/or cycle. You'll see lots of people on the forum have used this that are extremely conservative with what they put in their tank, and report the similar and very positive results. Generally it seems safe. But, you are taking a small gamble. That said, Cyano can have toxins, so choose your poison.

If you take the old fashion approach, you should recheck your water source as well. Some who fight cyano non-stop see that the water change actually causes heavy/new growth. Are you using tap, filtered, RO, or RO/DI water?

You probably know the other cyano fueling issues...lighting could be an issue, flow, etc...

The BIGGEST mistake I see when my customers use this produce is that they do not take into account water displacement of sand, rock, filter and etc. when dosing! This is a MUST when using this product and some of the problems mentioned may have been avoided. Although this product works well (if used as directed) it's a "band-aid" to the problem and not usually a fix. Also Banded Sleeper Gobies will usually eat cyanobacteria and reef safe. Again this is only a "fix" and not a cure.

Agree with Ron, and in fact I never ran a full dose on my calculated water volume (figuring what was displaced), just to be safe and err on the side of underdosing. You do not want to overdose.

Wow - Banded Sleeper Gobies? Amazing! Thanks for that tip, Ron.

 

[Vance]

I need a better test kit... mine only goes to .1ppm and it doesn't register on there. And i use tap water.... i know i know, im a broke @$$ college student, and i work full time on top of my 16 credits... no time to get 15 gallons of water a week. Bulbs were just replaced earlier this month and went to the bluer spectrum...

Not a persistent issue just something that has popped up since i started making changes, hoping it will pass with the right forethought. I bought the chemiclean so i may use it down the road...

 

[daverf]

Seachem phosphate test kit is a cheaper one that measures well down to .01...Lanthanum probably the cheapest way to drop phosphates (compared to GFO: pennies versus tens/hundreds of dollars, search the forum on Lanthanum)...RO (if not RO/DI) unit may save you lots of money in terms of problem avoidance (if you find one used on the forum and get it cheap)... maybe lay out some dough for those 3 things if you see the cyano explode in a few weeks, probably the best money you'd spend in solving this and many other headaches...otherwise it may just go as quickly as it came and you won't need to worry... good luck!

 

[Vance]

Got a second test on my phosphate, it is way to high. Tap water being added has no phosphate though so that's good, thinking its just the natural build up from vodka dosing ive heard about. Was reading an article about the use of nitrate to phosphate by algae's and bacteria is a ratio of about 16:1. Has anyone considered actually adding nitrate to their tanks to account for this ratio? about its seems that the organisms we use (macro algae's included) to remove nitrate and phosphate use up all the nitrate and are unable to remove the remaining PO4. New thread topic maybe?

 

[Vance]

Just theoretical not saying im gonna consider it. But interesting none the less