Mandarin Goby

303travism

Dolphin
M.A.S.C Club Member
#1
So I've had a Mandarin for awhile now and always wondered if it ate frozen food and I spend an arm and a leg trying to seed my sump, today I got 3 plate corals and basted them with frozen brine and when I walked by the tank I noticed Jimmy (the goby) was picking brine out of the plate like it was a dog bowl! I'll try and get pics next time.
 

lpsouth1978@msn.com

Users with zero posts needing moderation to determine if they are spam bots
#2
Is it a Green Mandarin or Target? The Target Mandarins are pretty easy to get to eat frozen foods, the Greens take a bit more work, but both can learn to eat frozen. I recently had a Target that would eat directly out of the turkey baster (until he decided to go carpet surfing).
 

303travism

Dolphin
M.A.S.C Club Member
#4
lpsouth1978;155723 said:
Is it a Green Mandarin or Target? The Target Mandarins are pretty easy to get to eat frozen foods, the Greens take a bit more work, but both can learn to eat frozen. I recently had a Target that would eat directly out of the turkey baster (until he decided to go carpet surfing).
Yep Green
 
#8
I tried to get mine to eat lots of different things, but I have a nice dirty tank with plenty of live stuff (apparently), so I gave up. I always see him hunting and pecking so he must be finding something.
 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#10
I have a green manderin for about a week now in my 16 gallon with plenty of live rocks. I made sure the tank was covered in pods before I added him. I also tried giving him frozen food but he did not budge. He looks fat right now and there's still so many pods everywhere. My assumption is that since there are no other competitors for pods in my tank it could be possible for it to sustain him with enough pods as well as giving enough time to let the pods reproduce and sustaining a healthy population for the manderin. Of course I could be wrong. I read a lot on people even with Hugh tanks losin manderins. Any one has any experiences with a small tank and a manderin? About 75% of my tank is filled with live rocks.
 
#11
Your watchman goby will compete for pods. 16 gallons is not big enough. I would really like to keep two mandarins in my 58gallon+29 gallon sump but I wont do it.

a quote from wetwebmedia.com
Hello, I am setting up a 55G FOWLR tank, with about 80Lbs of live rock. Do you think I would be able to keep a Green Mandarin in my tank after it matures (say 6 months), without adding a refugium?
 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#12
I read up on those and I know the odds are against me but I have so much pods in my tank and they keep multiplying fast all over the glass and rocks. The yellow goby I see him eat them once in awhile but he mainly eat pieces of shrimp I feed my pistol shrimp. Every time I feed the pistol shrimp the yellow watchman is there chomping as well. Ive had the dragonette now about a week and again he is still fat...can I beat the odds because of the high populations of pods I have? Plus I have 2 refugium running and just started cycling a 10 gal tank for farming pods
 
#13
I dont think it will be possible but I can't see the future.
Are you going to use phytoplankton to feed the pods?
If you are farming pods, you shouldn't need to cycle the tank.
How big are the refugiums and how long have they been running?

I have around 70-80lbs of LR in my system and I still kind of worry about my mandarin, I have lots of chaeto to use a critter matrix as well.

You may say you have a ton of pods, but I see my mandarin eating a pod or so every 5-10 seconds the entire time the lights are on and then even a couple hours after they are out. A quick reference of the amount of pods I estimate my lil guy is eating
1 pod every 5 seconds:
(1 pod/5 seconds)*(60 seconds/1 min)*(60 mins/1hour)*(14 hours/day)=10,080 pods a day
1 pod every 10 seconds:
(1 pod/10 seconds)*(60 seconds/1 min)*(60 mins/1hour)*(14 hours/day)=5,040 pods a day

So your tank must be capable of producing this many pods a day continuously and that means that a large population must exist that isn't eaten to sustain these numbers.

Im not trying to be an a**, I just want to let you know what you are getting into.
 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#14
Hahaha cute pod formula but no harm intended "you see with your eyes, so you're easy to fool". I'm trying my best to train him to eat frozen foods and I hope he will. I just really have no choice now and I'm not going to tear my tank full of rocks and corals just to get the guy to be honest. I mean really have you ever tried catching a fish in a tank full of everything? It's hard. If he dies then at least I know I have tried my best to provide him with everything I could think of and I know it's selfish of me but if I'm successful maybe others might have a chance to enjoy these beautiful fish even in a small tank. I have 2 hob that I converted into a refugium/DIY LEDs
 
#15
Catching a mandarin should be too difficult, they arent nearly as fast as most other fish. Ive torn down my 58 gallon to catch a pesky dottyback, it takes a couple hours but it was worth it for the end result making the tank much more peaceful. I realize im not going to be able to convince you to take him back the fish store or trade him with another member here. Good luck with the training. It is definitely possible, Ive heard the most success from using live brine and a breeders net. Keep feeding live brine and then add a little frozen brine until they start accepting that that food and keep upping the ratio of frozen:live until it is completely frozen and then mysis and bloodworms. I would recommend reading all possible literature and forum posting on training a mandarin to eat frozen. I haven't attempted it yet but I'd say Ive done at least +10 hrs of reading on the subject. If I get my mandarin a girlfriend, Im going to train her to eat frozen to minimize the chance of them running out of copepods.

Also, if you are trying to culture pods in a refugium, there is a post on use gutter net and making pod piles with LR rubble and then dropping a pile in every so often and switching them out. When school is out, I'm going to remove most of the LR in my refugium(it is filled to the brim with LR) and then add a bunch of these contraptions. They vastly increase the amount of surface area/volume of LR and should increase the pod population greatly.

EDIT: heres the link for making the pod piles

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=182691

EDIT 2: training a mandarin

http://www.marinebreeder.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1217

A guy who raises mandarins

http://www.marinebreeder.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1963








 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#16
Thanks for watching my back though I know you are just trying to help. Yea since I'm getting the pod farm running I will also try and keep live brine as well to feed him/her? he or she is so small that I can't determine the dorsal fin yet. How long will I be able to tell?
 
#17
What do you mean by a pod farm btw? And Im not sure about the age thing.
 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#18
I got a 10 gallon tank set just for raising pods (plus my 2 HOB filled with live rock and Cheetos). It's being filled with live rocks and a large amount of cheetos. Also nothing but snails and hermits. The age thing is because my manderin is too small for me to determine the sex. I have read the thread you gave me and I think the bag thing will work but still my ultimate goal will be training it to eat frozen foods. But hopefully my 3 so call pod farm set up will work, well enough to sustain it.
 
#19
Are you using flaming hot Cheetos or the puffed Cheetos? Im not sure copepods like the flaming hot :p.

I've heard hermit crabs may eat copepods, I'm not sure to what extent though.

The second link is more informative:

Chris, I know exactly how to do this. I've written it up several times, so pardon my brevity. I'll be happy to answer any questions you have!

#1. I put any new Synchiropus into a "Breeder Net" - it's a small net pen that you hang in the tank. This allows the Synchiropus to be isolated from the rest of the community, allowing it to settle in and not have to compete for food. This is the crucial first step...skipping this makes the rest relatively pointless!

#2. Start off with feeding ENRICHED adult live brine shrimp. Enriching is crucial...I like using Selcon for a final enrichment, and I feed the adult brine shrimp with phytoplankton I've cultured here (T-Iso, Nanno, Tetraselmis etc).

#3. What happens is that the mandarins get accustomed to taking the live brine shrimp. Having the breeder net, typically what happens is that external currents will push the live brine up against one of the sides of the container...so they get pinned there. So you have a live, wriggling brine shrimp sitting there on the "substrate", and to a Synchiropus this is a pretty natural presentaiton.

#4. Once the Synchiropus is feeding well on live brine shrimp, you start mixing in frozen enriched brine shrimp. While it doesn't wriggle, it otherwise looks the same and gets pinned to the side of the container just like the live stuff does. It may happen quick, or it may take weeks, but once you see the Synchiropus take the frozen brine a couple times, I generally quickly wean the fish off live brine.

#5. Once the fish is eating enriched frozen brine consistently, introducing new foods is simply a matter of time. The next food in the progression is frozen mysis, and FWIW, a Synchiropus will live, get fat and spawn on a diet of enriched frozen brine and mysis.

#6. Once the fish is feeding well on the foods I want to be sure it eats, the fish is ready to go into the tank at large. I've found using a "Feeding Station" (look this up in relation to Seahorses) works really well with Synchiropus (also look up Malev's Mandarin Diner). You have to watch the Dragonette to make sure it's getting what it needs and that it's found the feeding station and otherwise just not getting outcompeted. FWIW, this is probably more of a problem in a LARGER aquarium vs. a smaller one (i.e. I keep 2 Synchiropus splendidus and 2 S. stellatus in a 24 gallon cube...it works and "breaks the rules" because they're all fully trained onto prepared foods and I feed pretty heavily!) If the fish goes into the main tank and starts to get thin, you'll have to repeat the process or reconsider the community it's going into (obviously if we are talking a breeding situation with dedicated broodstock tanks, outcompetition shouldn't be an issue!)

Bottom line, once they settle in, they are pretty solid fish in my book. Obviously you need to start with healthy fish, i.e. avoid the really emmaciated specimens...they are too far gone. Look for the ones that are active and picking around the tank for food.

As far as PELLETS, my only thing with those is that it takes a LONG time. Luis made the observation that he tried an old batch and didn't have any luck..when he used a newly opened container they went right to it. Mine mandarins probably took 6 months or longer to accept pellets, whereas my Red Scooter Blennies may take them in as little as 2 week's time! Formula 1 pellets (smallest size) seem to be the ideal first pellet to offer -they're soft and have a really enticing smell. After that I've been able to get mine to also eat Formula 2 pellets and Spectrum Pellets.

Bottom line, If you take your time and dedicate the effort, you'll have no problem.

FWIW,

Matt
 

yOdaddy

Tang
M.A.S.C Club Member
#20
I have noticed competition for food in a big part of getting the manderin fed. Almost everywhere talks about how their manderin is not getting enough food because it has to battle agains a so call 6 line for pods. I mean realistically if I was a fish I would love eating pods, it's like a fat kid with cakes. Anyway I know it's going to be hard and it will take a lot of patience but in my case I'm going against the odds and not catch it but just to try and spot feed it and also with live brine. The brine actually get stuck in the rock crevices and wiggles anyway. Hopefully the manderin will munch on it like how I do with flaming hot Cheetos! Also with hermits you might be right, I have read that they are cannibalism as well and if that's the case I can't see why they won't eat pods. I had a skunk cleaner that was tearing the pods up before I gave him away. I mean everything eats pods and if I can eliminate the competition..there might just be enough pods for the dragonet.
 
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