Low Alk, what should I dose?

Haulin Oates

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#21
Yep! Even have some cupping coralline!! I used to dose Red Sea ABC powder before I knew better. I was turned to Randy's recipe and reef keeping ideas a few months ago and realized all I needed to dose was alk to get to area 1 on the quadrant. That's when I started baked baking soda. Just last week I had to dose calcium, but I also switched from instant ocean to Red Sea coral pro salt last week. So far I love it! My mag at one point was 1760, so it is slowly coming down, but I got a ways to go!!
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#22
Yea that article that Kalgra linked helped a lot as far as understanding the "zones" and target levels. I understood the science, but having a visual helps a TON. Funny though...I had googled my issue and bookmarked that article earlier today, but hadn't gotten to it reading yet. It does look like with my current issue I can get away with just dosing Alk until I'm at an acceptable range. After that I should be able to watch my parameters to ensure that everything stays where it should be. Once I get my Alk where I need it, I'll start watching the consumption in my tank to figure out if I need to dose 2 part or kalkwasser or just continue with my weekly water changes.
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#24
Turns out my initial suspicion about my api kit wasn't far fetched. After 3 days of dosing enough alk to bring my levels up to 8.0 from 6.5 I was still testing at 6.5

Brought my sample into elite...8.0 dkh. Purchased the salifert kit, brought it home...also 8.0

I'm going to bring it up to 8.5 tonight and keep an eye on things from there. For now:

Mag - 1260
Ca - 400
Alk - 8.0
pH - 8.4

Hopefully I've corrected for those low alkalinity salt mixes, and can get back to maintaining the levels with weekly water changes. We'll see...

Thanks everyone for the helpful input.
 

cdrewferd

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#25
Darn API tests. Thats why I upgraded to all Salifert about 1.5 mo the after buying the tank.


Drew

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#26
cdrewferd;165980 said:
Darn API tests. Thats why I upgraded to all Salifert about 1.5 mo the after buying the tank.


Drew

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yea...knew they were due for replacement, but I kept procrastinating on replacing them. I'm working on replacing my kits...so far I have the Mg and kH covered.

Everything in the tank is liking the better Alk levels. My leptastrea opened WAY up and had a bit of a growth explosion already...starting to sting some palys that were a couple inches away just days ago. Probably going to frag those pink palys to get them out of the way and take some new pics this weekend.
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#27
A little update...

Over the last 2 weeks I bumped up my Mg (to 1400) and started raising the Alk in the tank. Also finally picked up a Ca test so I could watch for consumption rather than just testing 2x a week to make sure my levels were within the normal range. I noticed that once I started dosing Alk, the SPS in the tank showed visible skeletal growth (go figure...). Also, it seemed that my Alk would essentially "bottom out" and not drop lower than that 6.7 mark which prompted me to start dosing in the first place. I'm not really understanding how that works...but nevertheless I was at least able to raise the Alk in the tank and watch it's consumption.

Current parameters
Mg: 1385
Alk: 7.0
Ca: 410

My Mg levels stay pretty stable...they drop 5-10ppm daily. Alk is being consumed at 0.8 dkh per day now that the SPS are actually happy and growing, and Ca is being consumed at 10ppm per day.

Right now I have Seachem products that I've been using to raise the levels (Reef Builder/Advantage Mg/Ca), but have a few questions.

I'd like to get my Alk to about 8.0ppm. Since I've just been mixing the buffer into a portion of my top-off water and adding it to the tank, I've only been adding enough to increase the Alk by 1dkh. Given the rate of consumption, I should in theory hit 8.0dkh at some piont next week if the tank is only consuming about 0.8 per day and I'm adding 1.0. Should I be concerned about the daily spike until I get to that point though? From what I gathered, it's best not to increase by more than 1.0dkh per day...can I mix a stronger solution and slowly drip it into the tank during the day time so that a little is extra is being added while the tank is also consuming it? In other words...mix enough to add about 1.5 or 2.0 dkh, but drip it slowly enough that by the end of the day the overall increase is 1.0 dkh or so and I avoid getting a spike.

At this point, I've basically confirmed that I won't be able to get away with just water changes in my tank. Things were fine til I added the SPS...definitely let myself get sucked in to that one ;) My original goal was to NOT have a complicated system that I'd have to manually dose daily, but it's definitely come to that. So, what's the next step if I want to dose the tank and avoid the daily grind of manual dosing? I also travel for work on occasion and live alone, so having some automation dialed in would be beneficial.

Right now I'm sitting on a JBJ ATO unit that I planned on just hooking up for RO top offs...but now I'm debating using it for kalk. That being said, I used a kalk calculator and it looks like without the addition of Vinegar to supersaturate the solution, I wouldn't meet the tank's consumption of 0.8dkh per day...I have a closed top on the tank and it evaporates very little water in a day (about 1200ml) so I'm limited as far as how much solution I can add. Also, if my Ca consumption remains where it is, adding enough kalk to support the Alk consumption would have me adding more Ca than I need...if I reduced the saturation of the solution to match Ca consumption I'd still have to supplement with manually dosing Alk...which is what I'm trying to avoid in the first place. Overall, the whole kalk + vinegar in my ATO just sounds almost as much of a headache as manual dosing.

Am I getting ahead of myself in considering manually dosing for a few weeks to get a handle on things, then picking up an auto-doser? Or should I just give the kalk a try and watch my levels? I'd rather not invest in a kalk stirrer to run in-line with my ATO...am I putting the tank at an unnecessary risk if I try to just add kalk to the ATO reservoir and call it a day? Just trying to get a consensus as I've come across 100 opinions on the subject. I'm definitely leaning towards a dosing pump since it'd give me better control of my levels...especially considering that the evaporation rate varies significantly in my tank day-to-day.

Thanks for putting up with my long post :stupid:

Thoughts?
 
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djkms

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#28
IMO - ditch the glass tops. Its pretty important for gas exchange to have a open top. You can always do what I do and create a open top with 1/4" netting if you are worried about jumpers.
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/clear-1-4-screen-netting-7-x-3.html
Check out the instruction videos on that page as well.

If its a all in one deal - nanocube or whatever, scratch what I just said lol.

As far as dosing, if I were you, in the situation that you described, I would go with dosing pumps and put them on a timer from home depot. Once you have them dialed in its pretty much smooth sailing.
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store...stems/brs-2-part-doser-1-1-ml-per-minute.html

http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical...splay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&storeId=10051
 

djkms

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#29
Also, you could easily get away with just using a dosing pump for alk and manually dose calcium. For every 1dKH of ALK your system consumes 7.14ppm of calcium. You could dose up to 50ppm per day of calcium without any side effect. Of course spreading it out is probably better but there are no reports of harm doing up to 50ppm that I have heard of. Just dont let the CA get below 380 IMO.
 

Haulin Oates

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#30
Yeah, my next purchase after the basement sump gets set up is dosing pumps. Makes it automated for sure!! I've fine tuned my dosing to 80mL a day baked baking soda solution and 40mL per day calcium solution. Alk is at 11 dKH and calcium is at 470 ppm.
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#31
Thanks for chiming in Kris, I probably will go ahead and grab a dosing pump then. It seemed to be the best way to control all of my levels accurately and avoid spikes and possible fluctuations with dosing kalk.

Unfortunately I'm unable to ditch the top of my tank since I have a nanocube. My lighting system is integrated into the hood. Gas exchange should be OK though with the 4 fans running on top of the hood, my MP10 being 3-4 inches from the water line, and I'm also running a large skimmer. My 6gal planted nano (a fluval edge) crashed due to lack of gas exchange last summer when the temps got too high...I was injecting CO2 for plant growth, and the lack of O2 nuked the 2-yr old tank ridiculously fast. :( Suffice to say...surface agitation was the first thing I made sure I had enough of in this setup!

Thanks again for the input.
 

jahmic

Reef Shark
M.A.S.C Club Member
#32
djkms;170394 said:
Also, you could easily get away with just using a dosing pump for alk and manually dose calcium. For every 1dKH of ALK your system consumes 7.14ppm of calcium. You could dose up to 50ppm per day of calcium without any side effect. Of course spreading it out is probably better but there are no reports of harm doing up to 50ppm that I have heard of. Just dont let the CA get below 380 IMO.
Interesting, I hadn't considered that. It does seem feasible that I could get my Ca where I want it and dose only 1-2 times a week to keep it in an acceptable range. It'd be a nice cost-effective approach with only using 1 dosing pump. That seachem advantage Ca also contains some Mg in it, and although I only used it just last night, I planned on going home to see if it helped keep my Mg steady. That be a nice way to take care of Ca and Mg...along with buffering my salt mix with a little extra Mg before each water change.

I'm gonna be doing a happy dance if I can manage to keep my Alk steady with one pump and avoid daily dosing. 1-2x a week of manual dosing I'm fine with, I already have that regimen going in my other tank.
 
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